Wolverine MTW - Any one in the UK own one?

[igotfips]

Hi all, I am new to the whole hpa-co2 in airsoft. I saw airsoft cam-man running one of these and I have spent the past few hours reading up online and in forums about the gun. 

My main enquiry is what am I looking to buy in terms of configuration, and then what I am going to need to run it effectively once I have the gun. Upgrades for it will come at a later date for myself as it’ll be my first HPA and I don’t want to blow my brain out with too much info. 
 

I have found a website called “highpressureairsoft” that lets you make your own and they’re built in Tennessee? Shall I make my own and if so what do I configure it at as it has multiple options for barrel length and engine etc. 
 

I also aren’t fussed about the CO2 stock either I am happy running a tank as I play as a ghillie most of the time anyway and aren’t exactly running and gunning too much. But also could this be run as a DMR (up to 450fps) for my site? 
 

Like I said I am new to HPA in general and would like some pointers towards this gun and any info I might need in the future regarding HPA, don’t be too mean to me ahah. 

 

[leadly]

? Looks like that's 2 of us that's have been impressed with his recent videos then!

I'll hopefully be picking this up next week to get me started. I'll be HPA tapping a few extended Glock mags for my AAP-01 pistol.

https://www.ukfob.co.uk/GBB-HPA-Starter-Kit-Tank-Line-Reg-and-5-Valves?tag=HPA

From what I saw on Facebook, High pressure Airsoft should hopefully be getting a restock on Monday.

I asked Airsoft cam man about his engine and he said he's using the Inferno Gen2.

Admittedly I wasn't expecting a restock so soon so I don't know if I can face spunking all that money while sites aren't even open! So I'll try to (but probably wont) hold off until next year!

I'll be going SBR spec for my length. Engine wise probably the inferno as I can't seem to find much info on the reaper M.

I'm sure someone who actually owns one will be along and answer your questions.....

 

[alxndrhll]

The biggest element to consider when looking at moving to HPA is the cost of your HPA set up itself as much as it is the RIFs.

First and foremost you need to consider how you’re filling your tanks. The cost of this can vary depending on the sites you tend to play at and if they offer refills. Assuming they don’t a scuba tank of some sort which filling adapters is generally recommended, assuming you have a dive shop locally that can fill your scuba tank.

The cost of your tank(s), line, regulator and ‘filling station’ will vary depending on what exactly to get, but in my experience/the experience of others I know which have done the same those 4 components will tend to run you £350-£450. So not a small expense by any means, and that’s before you’ve got any toys for that set up to power. Add in a £600 MTW, batteries and mags... you’re cruising over the £1000 mark.

As far as the MTW itself I’d tend to recommend the Inferno, especially to those new to HPA. Having spent a lot of time in various groups Reapers seem to be a lot more fussy especially when you come to wanting to swap out hop up components.

The ‘MTW builder’ is essentially there if you know exactly what you want, and exactly what you want isn’t available from a ‘stock’ configuration. Say for instance you want a 10.3” outer barrel, but a 7” rail and a CO2 stock installed by the folks at Wolverine. They’re very easy RIFs to work on, I’d tend to advise just picking up one of the standard ones and figure out what you want to change from there.

Length of the outer barrel/rail is largely down to your personal preference. Upgrades wise, as most will advise you, run it stock for a few games and if you feel you ‘need’ more out of it you can start messing around with the inner barrel and hop components.

 

[lukeB]

I went for the 10inch sbr initially when I ran it as a L119a2(ish), then just extended the barrel later on when I added the longer mk12 rail. 

If you intend to replace the included rail straight away, buying it with the 7inch rail might save you a little ££ on the configurator.

If you're play style is full auto then I would say just use the normal line with a tank. The small 13ci stock tanks are not going to last long on 35rps full auto but might be a good choice for a dmr.

 

[leadly]

Well looks like I've got a tough choice to make! My mates ordered the new Milspec (10" w/ reaper M) and the new forged (10" w/inferno 2).

Now I've got the decision of which one I want?

I'm 60 / 40 maybe even 70 / 30 in favour of the Milspec w/ reaper M as I like the idea of the purely mechanical engine.

I had a look over my mates lads and managed to dry fire it atleast this time. The trigger felt nice and still snappy enough even for a reaper M.

I intend on using it more in overgrown sites where sniping with my VSR isn't much fun. Don't intend on making it a DMR either. I dunno if I've aswered my own question or not?

Thoughts on a postcard?

Is it better to have the full auto and never use it? 

Anyone ever had electrical issues with the inferno from water ingress or anything?

It's going to cost me all of the money so wanted the one that'll be the most hard wearing. Obviously it'll get the love and maintenance it deserves!!

Tah

 

[alxndrhll]

More than anything I'd think long and hard before commiting to anything, you've kinda gone for 0 to 100 extremely quickly. I've seen many do the same when it comes to HPA, see a (heavy editted) video of a RIF doing really well and leap into 'must have now' mode. I wouldn't want to tread that fine line of discussing others financial situation/commitments but please think long on hard on how much 'need' there is, I think many of us have fallen victim to impulse buys what with lockdown and everything. This isn't intended as a 'go away noob' reply, so apologies if that's how comes across. I just know how easy it is for that craving for a shiny new thing can take hold, so please have a good think before rushing in.

Reapers seem to be a massive gamble whichever version it is, some just don't seem to perform very well. I don't know the in's and outs of why, my pressumption is largely down to feeding/being closed bolt but I can't say for sure. Ultimately it just removes of the option of full auto/burst should you want it, it's aimed at the 'milsim' crowd more than it is for your general skirmish day.

As for the electronics side of things, anything anyone here would be able to interject is relatively moot unfortunately. They're swapping out the electronics on the 'Forged Series' compared to what is in the what is now known as 'Billet Series' which the owners on here have. Regretably you won't really know the ins and outs until units are in folks hands, I suspect initially you're going to see a lot of folks not having a great time trying to get the Phoenix hop playing ball nicely. Putting that hop unit in them from stock is certainly a brave decision.

Edit: Jesus I've just seen the price on the 'Forged Series', definitely struggling to see what is justifying that price difference versus the 'Billet Series'.

 

[leadly]

Thanks for the quick reply.

Admittedly (like you've pointed out) I'm looking at buying one pretty quickly after showing initial interest. I was perhaps looking at buying one in the new year, as a rough time frame.

I hadn't expected them to come back into stock or come out with new variants this quickly, so it's taken me by surprise a little.

I am however in the fortunate position to only be paying trade price for the MTW, plus my share of the import tax and shipping fees. So I've got the safety net that if it doesn't work out for me or i don't like it I could comfortably make my money back or even a small profit if I felt that way inclined.

 

[Steveocee]

It's almost like cam man knew about the incoming stock and new revisions isn't it?

 

[leadly]

Mine arrives on Tuesday....  

 

[Hatchet]

Mine arrives on Tuesday....  

Nice, look forward to seeing a review. I've been keeping an eye on them for a while, but can't justify dropping that kind of cash in the current circumstances (plus lack of a regular site). I'd been holding off earlier in part due to the receiver. New one looks better, but my suspicion is that dust cover won't close as is - none of the photos/videos I've seen show that. Looks a good tool for some sneaky work.

 

[Steveocee]

Mine arrives on Tuesday....  

Monster! I'm just waiting for HPA to have the Cyber Monday sale. Going to try and pick up a P* Jack to drop into a CM16-SRS for a bit of a sleeper build.

You seen the FPS limits at MCG on HPA? 330fps on a 0.2. They do that so joule creepers can't get above 350 but still, can't help but think "chrono with the right weight BB and go for 1J eh". I'm sure a 1J MTW will still destroy most things out there. Beech corner won't know what's hitting it lol

 

[leadly]

Hopefully should debut it for a few games at Skirmish on Saturday if covid allows. Failing that I'll try get up to Matlock instead and give it a whirl once I've tested my VSR out in the morning.

 

[alxndrhll]

Nice, look forward to seeing a review. I've been keeping an eye on them for a while, but can't justify dropping that kind of cash in the current circumstances (plus lack of a regular site). I'd been holding off earlier in part due to the receiver. New one looks better, but my suspicion is that dust cover won't close as is - none of the photos/videos I've seen show that. Looks a good tool for some sneaky work.

From what I can gather your suspicion is correct in regard to the 'dust cover'.

The thing I'm most intrigued to see in the new batch is how the pre-installed Phoenix hop is working out. It's a really interesting design, but as with anything that adds 'precision' at the cost of complication they seem very fiddly to get shooting better than the stock (or at least what was stock) unit... which arguably says a lot about how good the stock unit is. If it shoots well out of the box I'd strongly recommend not changing anything!

 

[leadly]

Yes, from what I've seen in the Facebook group the ejection port cover stays open but apparently you can reverse the spring and do something else to make it stay shut 

My mates ordered 7 MTW's in total, so I've got the pick of either the 10" Milspec, 10" or 14" forged.

At this moment in time I'm 90% certain I'm taking home the Milspec. After going back through all of the posts on Facebook, people seem to only have issues when they try 3 different hop rubbers with 5 different barrels in 4 different hop units and then after that it's trigger micro switches breaking and programming modes going all over the shop.

I'm sure different issues will pop up with this new gen but I think I'll be more than happy with semi only. If I need full auto I'll just whip my AAP-01 out!

Not paying full retail makes the decision jump head first into HPA a little easier!

 

[alxndrhll]

Yes, from what I've seen in the Facebook group the ejection port cover stays open but apparently you can reverse the spring and do something else to make it stay shut 

My mates ordered 7 MTW's in total, so I've got the pick of either the 10" Milspec, 10" or 14" forged.

At this moment in time I'm 90% certain I'm taking home the Milspec. After going back through all of the posts on Facebook, people seem to only have issues when they try 3 different hop rubbers with 5 different barrels in 4 different hop units and then after that it's trigger micro switches breaking and programming modes going all over the shop.

I'm sure different issues will pop up with this new gen but I think I'll be more than happy with semi only. If I need full auto I'll just whip my AAP-01 out!

Not paying full retail makes the decision jump head first into HPA a little easier!

For sure, I've been impressed by the incrimental upgrades/improvements they make as a company so I see no reason to expect them to be any worse than the previously available offerings. Definitely some nice 'quality of life' changes in there, assuming the changes to feedtube/retention and the hop don't royally screw feeding up it's hard to see how it could be objectively worse... I'm sat here hoping they'll turn their eye to the AK platform now, though I'm not holding my breath!

In terms of playing around with hop components that's just the nature of the beast, and airsoft fallacies regarding 'the best length and bore barrel' certainly confuse things slightly. But it's all part of the fun, I love tinkering around... even if the end result ends up worse than where I started. It's such a simple platform to work on swapping things back is a piece of cake (Phoenix hop aside, but my experience is anecdotal at best).

 

[leadly]

Monster! I'm just waiting for HPA to have the Cyber Monday sale. Going to try and pick up a P* Jack to drop into a CM16-SRS for a bit of a sleeper build.

You seen the FPS limits at MCG on HPA? 330fps on a 0.2. They do that so joule creepers can't get above 350 but still, can't help but think "chrono with the right weight BB and go for 1J eh". I'm sure a 1J MTW will still destroy most things out there. Beech corner won't know what's hitting it lol

Obviously I'm quite new to the sport and HPA so I've not come across this before but why the limit for HPA users? The BB dosn't know what's propelling it and I could just as easily use joule creep to cause maximum pain with my VSR. (Recently lowered the spring to avoid having a 2.8j RIF when firing 0.46's.)

 

[lukeB]

With HPA the concern is often how easy it is to just pump up the psi whilst in the field.
Tournament locks should resolve this, but I've never seen a site enforce them.

As you say, my SRS can joule creep as much as my hpa guns but that comes with a minimum engagement and is single shot.

The big concern for me would be getting hit full auto at close range with a creeping gun on heavy weights.

I did some testing recently as you should always be aware how your guns behave with heavy weights.

My MTW DMR jumps from 1.88J to 2.61J when I use 0.48's (39% creep) 469mm barrel

My full auto HPA guns jump from 1.14J to 1.41J on 0.32. (23% creep) 300mm barrel

 

[Steveocee]

Obviously I'm quite new to the sport and HPA so I've not come across this before but why the limit for HPA users? The BB dosn't know what's propelling it and I could just as easily use joule creep to cause maximum pain with my VSR. (Recently lowered the spring to avoid having a 2.8j RIF when firing 0.46's.)

It's to do with cylinder to barrel ratio. Ideally you match your cylinder volume to the barrel, no air wasted, no slowdows, perfect exchange.

When you run HPA you have a huge cylinder volume so you have an excess amount of air, the air has to go somewhere, this means that the air displaces a lightweight BB easily and then the excess air just is unused and is vented out the barrel, this can cause a bit of turbulence and is a minor issue. The real issue is when you stick heavier ammo in as then that excess air gets utilised in pushing the BB out as it needs more behind it to get it going. That's joule creep.

What you experienced with your VSR is the same as the cylinder in a VSR, especially for a Gspec with 303mm barrel, the cylinder volume is larger than the barrel volume.

MCG have kind of done the right thing, just expressed it in the wrong way, they want to remove joule creep but instead of chronoing on joules or even the weight you are using and converting down to 350 they have said 330 on a 0.2 which is effectively 1J however 330 on a 0.2 could be abused on a very creepy build with heavier ammo to be above the equvalent of a 0.2 at 350 (which is the AEG limit).

Yes in theory you could creep like buggery and get away with it on sites that chrono on a 0.2. I watched someone chrono at NPF with a 0.2 and get 480fps and then stick some .43's through and get 400fps. The guy opted not to use it as he was a decent person BUT the marshall was fine with it (I was like WTF?!?! and clearly there is a hole for education - yes I brought this point up with them - no I didn't ever get a reply).

I set my snipers hopup for the correct weight and chrono from there. Even my spiciest sniper does 317 on a 0.48 which I think when you look at a conversion table is about 490 on a 0.2? I'm happy as I won't joule creep, I'm well within site limits and I have a small buffer for a dodgy chrono. I will also be perfectly fine if I go to a site that chrono's correctly in J's as well as a lot of the guys buying Novi SSG's are going to be absolutely on the limit with a 0.2 and will go way over when they go heavy weight.

 

[lukeB]

Unfortunately the airsoft obsession now is to the have the best most powerful gun at 99.999% site limit. 

Joule creep just allows the idiots and cheats to deliberately break those limits and then claim ignorance if caught.

If sites can't police J limits, I'd suggest chrono full auto's on 0.3/0.32 and snipers/dmr on 0.40+. 

That would negate most of the crazy joule creep builds and improve safety.

 

[leadly]

I see, I have learnt many things!

My plan was to run it at 1j or just below and use something like 0.25g BB's. I shall whack a Nov modular supressor on the end of it for maximum ssssshhhhh.

I've got loads of different weights to okay around with so we shall see what I can achieve. I'll make a project thread when it's in hand!