Epsom Bunker (Londonish)

[BrightCandle]

Date: 30th April 2014

I was only there for 2 hours as its such a long trek home I couldn't do the complete night. We started out with 3 teams in 3 different corners with 5 lives and a search and destroy the other teams mission. This really introduced me to the basic layout of the site and getting my first impression of the bunker. Its dark, really dark, like pitch black dark. There are lights scattered around and if you are in one the dark areas are impenetrably dark. If you are in the dark the light areas affect your night vision but they are few and far between. I used a torch most of the night which meant I got shot a lot because I gave away my position, but since I couldn't see otherwise it was the safe option. The guys that know the site well don't use lights at all, but they also pop out briefly in a corner, fire a shot to where the enemy could be and then disappear back in. Knowing the site is vital to the way this site is played and there is a set of skills to develop here to be effective.

The site was interesting although I didn't particularly enjoy the game as most of it I was walking around in near total darkness with not a lot of people around me and the occasional bounced sound of a couple of shots. The games weren't all that exciting nor tactical, you just had to push through fatal funnel after fatal funnel in pretty much all the games we played, and that is based on having 3 tunnels that are interconnected horizontally. There isn't much opportunity to flank and the defenders set themselves up in almost impossible positions to beat. It takes a lot of goes to push a defender off their position.

There were a few oddities with the site which are worth mentioning. The first is that it was not clear what team I was on! It seems the organiser and the players know their teams so well already that as a new guy you just sort of tack yourself onto one of the teams, although one of them definitely wasn't interested in the new guy so I ended up following the guy who I setup next to who seemed to know his way around. No idea if the teams were fair or not. The second oddity is that there was no chrono testing at the beginning of the game at all. There is a site limit of 328 fps like other CQB sites in London but they didn't test for it. In this game I ended up with the worst welt I have ever had on my little finger. It filled with blood and the skin was raised about 8mm from its normal position and I had bleeding internally to my hand to all joints in that finger. I couldn't move it until I drained the blood out of it. It only just recovered (over a month). My finger was actually fractured according to the GP. I don't know what that says about the power of the gun that shot me, but I have never had anything like that from other sites, I would not be surprised if that was a very hot gun for the ranges we were playing (sub 10m mostly). The darkness and the wet puddles and uneven floor that you can't see combined with no chronograph or checking of safety kit and the general inability to see in my mind makes this quite a dangerous site.

The two guys I shot that evening (its low on action most of the time) I didn't actually see either of them, I heard them and I fired a shot where I thought they must be, but its not that I was blind firing I just couldn't see anybody because they were in the dark. I also shot one friendly in the light, and because none of the teams have armbands or anything else its basically impossible to identify if someone is on your team and there was a lot of friendly fire in general on the night. Its all fueled but the incredible darkness that dominates this site, you can't see who you are shooting at and the regulars when you call "attacker" will say "yes attacker" and then shoot because they are actually a defender. I am not sure if that is the rules or what but I saw a lot of friendlies shooting each other and mostly we didn't know who was who and where the enemy actually was because it was impossible to communicate across the 3 tunnels.

So I am in two minds. On the one hand the two games I played (both an hour long which was cool) filled me with adrenaline because of the sneaky aspect of it (don't bring a hicap!!!) and there were some high moments of hunting people through the darkness and following noises and such that kept you on your toes, but it also meant I missed the end of the second game a bit as everyone got called back (presumably) but I didn't hear any calls and found myself alone on the site and wandered back. On the other hand I didn't feel safe the whole night nor did I fully understand the games, which team I was on etc. Its a bit of a weird site filled with regulars and it will take a while to penetrate the veil and level of unfriendliness I felt. Overall I wont be going back anytime soon, its too far to travel and the fact I ended up with a fractured finger is just indicative of the safety concerns I had on this site. But really the dark is the main enemy at Epsom Bunker and beating it is all about site knowledge and maybe night vision!

 

[jcheeseright]

sounds a bit shit really.

 

[Customgun]

You probably weren't aware that the Wednesday evening you chose was the first time we had been open for business since the tunnels had been flooded, the water eventually rising right up to the ceilings (12ft!) for nearly 3 months! A traumatic time for us, but at least it wasn't our homes.

What added insult to injury was the break in by local scumbags who actually torched through the steel front door and stole the genny and anything they could grab.

The floodwater reached from the base of the front door to the rear of the site and destroyed the barricades, partitions and the lighting system. Large numbers of the regular (and not so regular) players generously gave up their free time to help clear up the mess and shovel the thick mud from the floor. We filled two 14 yd skips over two weeks whilst the water levels slowly dropped. Large and copious amounts of WD40 sprayed into light fittings brought some back to life, but the dimmer switch and RCD panel will require a little more TLC. We cannot praise those who helped out too highly, sloshing through dirty water up to their waists clearing blocked drains and salvaging anything not destroyed. All the time in semi darkness lit only by portable floodlights.

We have managed to get the red light system up and running but will be replacing the old lights with LED floodlights over time which should prove more resistant to the more idiot of the airsofter spectrum who think its cool to shoot them out. However as we still had to pay rent for the site despite not being able to use it we need to make up some money for the repairs. (100+ lights!)

Frankly armbands don't work down there due to the gloom, but if anyone comes up with a cheap form of identification (glowsticks are one option considered) we would be eternally grateful.

We will in future empersise that players must answer honestly if questioned as to their team, or not reply at all. We had probably got out of the swing of things during our enforced break.

I don't understand how you thought the players unfriendly, you have to make an effort to make friends, being British we tend to be a little emotionally stilted, so perhaps bring a friend next time. We find them a friendly bunch, but then again we would - they give us money.

We do chrono guns and everyone is checked by marshals as they leave the safezone to ensure they pull their masks down and ditto when they return with the mag removed from their weapon.

 

[jay83]

ya one of my team mates goes all the time and wants us all to go, does not seem like my kind of thing though i like a good mix of open and CQB if possible

 

[Customgun]

We have noticed a pretty clear split between players who enjoy close up cqb and those who prefer the wide open spaces!

There are a good few who come to both, but the majority are clearly polarised.

Still, it would be boring if we all liked the same things.

 

[Caliber]

Epsom isn't too far from me. How much do they charge there? Seems worth a try.

 

[Customgun]

£15 per evening for own guns, £25 for gun hirers inc 1500 rds. Both inc Can of soft drink and choccy bar.

£25 /£45 for alternate Sunday games inc lunch

www.eliteactiongames.com

 

[Sitting Duck]

Went Sunday 27th, wasn't too busy and a mix of regulars & newcomers hiring guns - about 30 aprox in total.....

First couple of things you notice, it is quite dark or low lit - even with lights on so if you haven't got some sort of torch/flashlight

you are gonna be in $hit a bit when they start playing some really dark games with just a few red lights on. Plus it is much cooler

underground probably coz of brick built even on warm days - not bad thing coz I sweat like a pig running around

(another thing - you won't be sprinting too much for too long unless you like running into walls, just moving briskly at best)

We went out in groups of 3 first to get a feel of this maze like place with a regular, he knew his stuff and showed how important

it is to keep peeking EVERY corner, well he was leading but soon got taken out so we are on our own - $hit this stuff is for real

The idea was you get hit - go back to safe/spawn and collect another different two people to get people mixing and learn the

place a bit - good idea but think maybe groups should of increased to say 5 or 6, one time we not made it out long and got lit

up from another party of 3 also going out - so you had quite a few groups out there plus some last men standing of a group

Now I am not gonna go on too much about some game modes being good or not so good - you get that at all sites.

Kudos - to all players, they all seemed to be a good fair playing bunch, massive respect to one or two - especially

the zombie & terminator guy who wasn't too bad when I auto'd him instead of semi coz I was outside having a pi$$/smoke when

game brief started - sorry m8 but he was ok about it. Sure these guys like a bit of pain coz most of time it is full auto down there

The Tunnel Rats obviously really know their stuff and it shows, they play very effective and aggressive - no not a bad way but they

are not scared to go for it when many like me would hesitate about advancing - nope they feckin go for it and are deffo not noobs

It is why they performed very well in competitions - it is their play style, not relying on bangs or smokes - well smokes can't be used

coz of ventilation down there btw, also no lasers they recently announced.

Lunch was decent - hot dog - even double sausage, donut & coke - btw do not get left inside coz they turn generator off so whole

place in darkness whilst outside eating lunch - one story was a bloke a while back was inside not realising game ended and then

they had lunch - he was inside in TOTAL DARKNESS - it is fecking pure black. When they returned he was a bit shaken up after

being stuck down there for nearly 1 hour. Now I don't know if that is true but hopefully they are a bit more careful to ensure all out

I can understand that, got caught myself going back out to find nobody in the centre of action.....

They have speaker system but they say they use lights to signal end of game - flickering of lights etc.....

This is not always clear especially to newcomers, they have speakers and should imho properly announce

"Game Ended - Return to Safe Zone" once or twice

Also this is CQB - real cqb, so I knew my gun was under 330fps, but the chrono was out but in actual fact it wasn't used, plus

they annouced they will let ya go a bit over 340 or so.....

Not a bad thing allowing a tiny bit of tolerance but ffs if you got the chrono then feckin use it !!!!!!!!

Sorry but this is second site now I have visited and no chrono of guns - which to me is bollox

I think though they forgot and will put my hand up to returning to safe zone with mag in gun so I should have been shot with own

gun - did this TWICE - so I am a c u n t I know, no excuse even though I kinda lost my way and was pumped up/excited/preoccupied

(well in actual fact I did get shot with my own gun coz it is so feckin dark I though gun wasn't firing I shot my hand - ouch it is working)

I think it wasn't really my kind of thing but was trying to stick it out a bit after lunch, we played a game similar to invasion but was a

bit too feckin intense and not a bad thing, but when hit you fall back - but it was just such a stream of full auto fire coming down all

the time as you raise hand and walk back you just get pummelled in the back ffs from the streams of fire

I can take a hit but with t-shirt & light jacket on it starts to sting a bit, and it was happening loads of times to people - many of us were

getting quite pi$$ed and could be a possible situation where it could get out of hand getting lit up in back when dead man walking....

At this point - think we were at a serious disadvantage, not sure if teams were split fairly but we started to think this ain't funny

I tried but thought nope, gonna call it a day, it was ok up to this point, not much objective play but different and haven't done cqb since

April, but lit up in back again n again is not what I call enjoyment so gathered up my stuff and call it a day. I met the owner outside and

had a chat with him, seemed to know his stuff and his team are very good but admitted it isn't for everybody and it is also very different

to most other cqb as in dark tunnels and the gamestyle or enviroment. But it does promote or yes I will admit it can improve you in ways

Peeking especially, learning about shadows and just generally full on going for it. I ain't no pussy but perhaps not quite the mad pitbull

I might have thought I was

No hard feelings - well a few in my back but was starting to subside a bit, wished him well, thanked him and drove home....

I may go again in month or two, you gotta see how green the grass is on other side, but will deffo get a plate for my back next time

It is VERY VERY DIFFERENT to normal Airsoft sites, even other cqb does not fully prepare you for tunnel skirmishes like Epsom

I think you should try it though, it is different, a little frantic at times and on the day I went the guys seemed to be pretty decent too

(which makes a big difference)

Hopefully chrono was a glitch error - I made bad mag-in mistakes too, perhaps annouce game over on PA system, and a few tweaks

or mix of games/styles - plus anyone going remember a few things:

TORCH - it is feckin' dark, sometimes had to feel my back for a few pitch black yards in some areas

PROTECTION - backplate in my case, I had full face as I like my teeth where they are

Make sure you gun is setup real sweet coz unless you got tracer you ain't gonna see $hit where they are going down there

so forget about tweaking hop-up - well it is so close it won't matter too much but you won't see much without tracer unit

Glad I went, not sure if it is for me but think I will go again as it isn't too far and the guys were all ok in my book which helps

I have tried to write an honest review - yup I f*cked up a couple of times too but owner I think could tell, but I got told sternly

when I messed up - it is a bad foolish - no stupid mistake to make, I normally just pull mag straight out when I'm hit & clear

chamber a few times on my walk back but somehow kept forgetting at least twice - kudos he clocked me so they are on the

ball hence think chrono was a remote one off oversight too.

Deffo give it go chaps - if you got the balls but bring torch/backplate

 

[Charlie_]

I went to epsom, all very friendly there and had a great first skirmish!

 

[Sitting Duck]

I think it is good but very very different from "normal" woodland sites

yup - will be going back I reckon but perhaps a little better prepared

(well a torch does help when you get lost in dark)

 

[BrightCandle]

The problem with using a torch is that the guys that know the site really well don't use it, it just gives away your position. The regulars complain bitterly at you if you use a torch. Personally I think its the only safe way to make your way around the site, the pot holes and such are quite hazardous so being able to see is kind of important, but unfortunately if you do it your eyes will never adjust enough to the gloom to see the targets sitting in the dark spots.

I wouldn't recommend a torch for this site.

Question for Charlie_ - Did you see them do chrono? Because it seems they just don't do it, and since my finger turned out to be fractured I think its pretty clear there are hot guns in Epsom bunker.

 

[Sitting Duck]

A torch certainly helps in you get lost in dark playing some darker games...

once or twice I had to feel my way back for a few yards saying:

"dead man walking - dead man lost - dead man can't see a f*cking thing where he is going"

Yeah the torch in gameplay is a trade off for giving yourself away - but if you come to crossroad

or junction - how can you tell if enemy is down that dark tunnel either...

At least one regular had a really pukka torch at end of barrel - think it might have been in flash

hider or barrel & a switch coz saw him point & flash on/off quickly as he was moving about checking

But at least keep something to hand/pocket even those windup hand kiddy torches would be something

if you keep kissing the dark walls

Chrono - well I like to think it may have been an oversight or foolishly forgot - most were regs or hire guns

but they had it out - jeez my site TWA are absolutely $hit hot on this - morning/lunch time they chrono any

joiners & mark gun to prove it was chrono'd. One time gun jammed and got another exact ICS out but nope

HAS to be chrono'd by marshall - and on occasions they make you use their M4 mag with 0.20g's in to help

ensure people don't cheat chrono running .30's etc.....

Coz of this, I tend to expect chrono at any site I visit - yes chrono is only a rough starting guide

a well setup 300fps can travel/hurt more than a crap 350fps aeg but it is a rough guide to ensure

we are all running with "similar" $hit so to speak

Anything at 10 or 20 feet will sting a bit depending on a few things but it would offer some assurance to all

players if we chrono'd our $hit - otherwise I might as well take along a 450fps CO2 pistol and all that

and other guy then gets out a DMR on full auto - nah crazy $hit we don't need

I look at Epsom as say a kind of full contact site - like in martial arts

Many years ago I went from normal martial arts - no not f*ckin girly self defense but half decent style

and went to a kick boxing - well it was at our dojo & some yank ran it - jeez I thought I could take a kick

but this was full on - picked me up and transported me a way still attached to guys foot !!!!!

yeah I only did that twice and thought - forget that crap - lol

Well that is how I view Epsom and/or some other bunker/tunnel skirmishes - dark and full auto mostly

at close range - not your 25m shots like most other sites

BUT hopefully when I next go I will see them chrono all guns first - or I will get lit up for writing this about them

that was my only real concern - plus get a back plate next time

 

[Charlie_]

The problem with using a torch is that the guys that know the site really well don't use it, it just gives away your position. The regulars complain bitterly at you if you use a torch. Personally I think its the only safe way to make your way around the site, the pot holes and such are quite hazardous so being able to see is kind of important, but unfortunately if you do it your eyes will never adjust enough to the gloom to see the targets sitting in the dark spots.

I wouldn't recommend a torch for this site.

Question for Charlie_ - Did you see them do chrono? Because it seems they just don't do it, and since my finger turned out to be fractured I think its pretty clear there are hot guns in Epsom bunker.

Nope no chrono.

Click to shrink...

 

[PT247]

I liked the evenings I have played at The Tunnels, I love the pitch black and only ever used a torch to indicate I was dead or when returning to the safe zone. Chrono'ing guns I think is something that should be done at all sites, especially in places as dark and close as Epsom, but saying that they will chrono a gun that is reported as running hot.
I've not done a full day here yet, but all the evening games have been great fun and to be honest are about long enough for the size of the site.
As said before smokes are not allowed to be used, but flash bangs are.... the games I have played there though they didn't count as kills which is frustrating, I am looking forward to going again with a bandoleer filled with M203 shower grenades though

All the folk I have met there, be it new players or The Tunnel Rats have been very friendly and welcoming and the more experienced of them were more than happy to team up and show the new folk around.
It is BLOODY dark down there and very close quarters.... absolutely epic fun, really gets your heart beating as you make your way around as quietly as possible.
I've not been since before the flooding but have been told the barricades have now been rebuilt.... watch out for knife kills in the shadows!

 

[Albiscuit]

Went the wknd after xmas...

I am glad I had not read these reviews though as I had the best skirmish so far!!

Fair enough I have not got the greatest experience of Airsoft sites, only visiting Mall and Bunker 51 a few times each but Epsom Tunnels was something else. It was PURE close quarters. The atmosphere down there was great, it was eerie and tense as you never knew who was coming down the tunnels. Often I managed to creep around corners and appear behind the enemy.

I used my pistol more times in this one day of skirmishing than I have in the past 6 skirmishes I think. It was great. The players were friendly, there seemed to be a lot of regulars who were welcoming and offered advice. One guy in particular who was a player/marshal was proper sound and I ended up shadowing him for a lot of the early games and he gave me squad leader and defender leader duties for some of the afternoons harder games too which was cool.

The game types were structured well, the first game was a roaming 3 or 4 man team game to give people a feel for the layout, the next few were objective games which were great fun and the last few were fun games, Zombies and balloon game (think MarioKart battle, you have a balloon strapped to your backside and that is your life, pistols only). The games suited the zone completely. some of the games at Mall and Bunker I have played tend to turn into team death match despite there being a clear objective, however here people worked together to complete the objectives.

That being said there are a few minors, the site is very basic, no toilet was not an issue, but lack of basic facilities will put a lot of people off.

Team games could certainly use a bit more identification. A few times I ended up having a conversation with the enemy at a junction as we assumed we were on the same team. We both called hit and went back to or spawns as the atmosphere was very gentlemanly.

the lack of marshals was a different experience, granted there were player/marshals who kept things moving and there was no actual need for a marshal I could see, but a bit of clarification when a game was over could be useful, I got shouted at for full autoing a group heading towards me as the game was over and I never realised :wub:

The atmosphere and game types for me were spot on and I am hoping this was not a one off, as I have just booked to go again at the end of Jan Could see this being a regular haunt of ours, (beats bunker 51 for sure)

 

[PT247]

out of interest (because of the original post where a hit fractured the OP's finger) did they chrono everyones guns at the start of the day?

 

[Sitting Duck]

It is a "full contact" sort of site like I said - a LOT of engangement takes place at 10ft or so

so it will sting a bit more than most hits at say woodland sites

They may not chrono or forgot to chrono when I visited

But the regulars are very good sports - yup I full auto'd a couple when it was semi only

The Tunnel Rats are also very good players plus they are playing on their own turf so to speak

But they have won numerous cqb/tunnel competitions at other sites.

Quite a few use tracers with a mix of norm/tracer bb's so they can see their shots in the gloomy dark

They need to announce on PA system when game/round finishes as they say they flicker lights but

if you are a newbie you may not notice it - I didn't once or twice. Still no site is 100% perfect I guess

You can't really describe it to be fair - it is SO different to the run of the mill skirmish site - even reg cqb sites

It is often nigh on pitch black, and if there is light then watch out for shadows giving your/others position away

you need a torch sometimes to find ya way back and perhaps some extra layer or two or plate unless you like pain

No it ain't that bad most of time but it bloody stung a bit getting lit up in back when I was retreating back to respawn

(so even a bit of carboard or something would of took that sting out a bit)

BUT - I did enjoy it, might not be my regular cup of tea but I will go back there but a bit better prepared next time

 

[Albiscuit]

Been 3 times now, love the site, lack of facilities is a gripe and out of three times only been chronod once. Even this one wasn't compulsory and guns were not marked.

It seems a very relaxed site on rules and regulations with a lot of onus on people being honest and acting appropriately. So far its seemed to work but a bit more structure and a bit more consistency would be good as it only takes one twat to ruin the day for everyone and lots of people not knowing the place may not return.

Games types can be hit and miss, had some great says, but many game type can easily end up looking the same, groups of players against regulars with knowledge of cover and much better firepower holding off everyone else and junctions for an hour can be tedious when your attacking teams get funnelled into one corridor and no one moves or advances as sometimes theres honestly no point attacking.

I have sat out of games as they ended up a shooting fish in a barrel type game for the defenders and they become boring.

The roaming type games are the best ones, small groups ideally staying together with objectives or against other groups is great, as people get picked off its very tense and more fun than 30odd guys hanging around a corner too scared to advance.....

However as a site its great, the regulars are proper sound, John who runs it is very helpful and a guy called Bob never seems to be having a bad day and offers loads of encouragement to teams and loves helping attackers.

Its defo a site we will keep visiting, yes like loads of sites it could be better, but nothing so far has put me or my 5 mates off going back so far.