Rushers / Speedsofters

[Leader Bee]

Kill house is quite small and there are only two main corridors leading to the enemy base either side of the dark room, if you managed to squeeze past everyone when there are only those routes I say good on you.

I can appreciate the irritation of being spawn camped though but if it's not against the rules then fair play.

 

[Cleggy]

Kill house is quite small and there are only two main corridors leading to the enemy base either side of the dark room, if you managed to squeeze past everyone when there are only those routes I say good on you.

I can appreciate the irritation of being spawn camped though but if it's not against the rules then fair play.

How would you define spawn camping there though? I'd say if you're base is chrono side of the arena, then the couch room and tire stack next to it is acceptable. And for car side, moving around car across to light stacks is acceptable. I wouldn't hold the small angles that show enemy spawns, just catch them coming out of there side of the map into the middle so to say.

Edit - I've been killed my people who push my base but not spawn and I look up at it, it's quite difficult to get into such positions to begin with, let alone moving around in a fashion that you're not in the same spot, but predicting enemy movements against your previous ones. 

I think all in all I just wanted to get some opinion into the area of speedsofting and people who are super aggressive and fast. I see lot's and lot's of different styles of play, and taking advantage of in game weaknesses isn't my problem but yours. ?

 

[Rogerborg]

I can appreciate the irritation of being spawn camped though but if it's not against the rules then fair play.

It can be subjective, which is where spats might occur.  In my situation yesterday there were other routes available, and I was giving them the opportunity to emerge, take cover, or to spot and engage me.  When they all chose to clump up in the open about 10m from the spawn and chat, or to take cover facing the wrong way, it was game on.

However, from their point of view I might have been a spawn camping villain who was only capable of shooting them in the backs (with an AEP, just to add to the humiliation) before they were "ready".

It's really a matter for marshals and sites to deal with, to clear it up for everyone.

 

[Cleggy]

It can be subjective, which is where spats might occur.  In my situation yesterday there were other routes available, and I was giving them the opportunity to emerge, take cover, or to spot and engage me.  When they all chose to clump up in the open about 10m from the spawn and chat, or to take cover facing the wrong way, it was game on.

However, from their point of view I might have been a spawn camping villain who was only capable of shooting them in the backs (with an AEP, just to add to the humiliation) before they were "ready".

It's really a matter for marshals and sites to deal with, to clear it up for everyone.

Marshal was aware of what I was doing, and didn't say a word but laughed when I jumped because someone rushed me hahaha. However, the post was focused on player mentality towards speedsofters if it is allowed at said site.

I think it's fair to be irritated by a player on the enemy team who is always up your arse and knife killing you. However when it gets to the point where firing rounds at me when Im dead (multiple rounds on multiple occasions) shooting me when the games not even started and just laughing it off and in game rage (Heard someone calming him down I think) due to dying is a different kettle of fish. I've never seen that sort of anger in Paintball, nor Airsoft before. 

 

[Nicky blue eyes]

In some ways its quite refreshing to play against a speedster because it can change up what has become a bit of a stale game. It keeps you on your toes a bit.

 

[Immortal]

I think the only time Speedsofting may be negative to a game (IME) is when there is a limited amount of respawns for a team.

We get a few Speedsofters in games occasionally and I have no issue with it. But it isn't so cool when they are just getting hit constantly using up the teams lives when the other players are trying to make them count. It's not the Speedsofting style rather than the rate and amount of spawns they get through.

However if spawns are unlimited then it's of no consequence how you play as long as it's fair.

I don't agree with Spawn camping but it depends how extreme. KM is an extreme spawn camper for example, literally scalping players in the spawn (but you aren't doing that so all good). Sometimes teams just get pushed back so far you end up playing on the boarder of the spawn unless the Marshals intervene.

 

[Arwen]

For me a good day is when both teams have a mix of players who shoot at range, and some that do the rushing game play. 

So long as you take your hits and don't overkill I don#t see a problem. Some people always have to whine though... They feel that their bbs go further than they think, or that they are auto seeking bbs 

 

[Robert James]

I wouldn't say speedsofting isn't tactical though, I plan my route in a way that allows friendlies to push and gain positions, trading with a camper to regain rooms and what not. It's tactical play to be fast and efficient, rather than laying down 5 mags down a narrow corridor hoping for the best.

I wasn’t suggesting it wasn’t tactical. I think just assume you’re running around like a headless chicken giving people more shots to the head than a bukkake party

 

[Druid799]

I think the only time Speedsofting may be negative to a game (IME) is when there is a limited amount of respawns for a team.

We get a few Speedsofters in games occasionally and I have no issue with it. But it isn't so cool when they are just getting hit constantly using up the teams lives when the other players are trying to make them count. It's not the Speedsofting style rather than the rate and amount of spawns they get through.

However if spawns are unlimited then it's of no consequence how you play as long as it's fair.

I don't agree with Spawn camping but it depends how extreme. KM is an extreme spawn camper for example, literally scalping players in the spawn (but you aren't doing that so all good). Sometimes teams just get pushed back so far you end up playing on the boarder of the spawn unless the Marshals intervene.

I’ve never come across this system before (set number of team lives) what site uses it ? 

Only ever come across individual lives in game .

 

[MisterG]

I think he means a limited number of re-spawns for the team as a whole.  Eg at one of the sites I play at regularly defenders may have 20 respawns, and attackers have unlimited to keep the game moving.  One defender might use 10 respawns, while another might get none if he gets killed after all the 20 have been used up.

 

[Cleggy]

I think he means a limited number of re-spawns for the team as a whole.  Eg at one of the sites I play at regularly defenders may have 20 respawns, and attackers have unlimited to keep the game moving.  One defender might use 10 respawns, while another might get none if he gets killed after all the 20 have been used up.

I don't think anyone would rush in like a headless chicken though if you have a limited amount of respawns for the team unless they are 100% noob of the earth. I agree though, speedsofting could be detrimental in these circumstances, but wasn't the case in the original post. 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I’ve never come across this system before (set number of team lives) what site uses it ? 

Only ever come across individual lives in game .

site i used to go to would occasionally run that for killhouse games, respawn you left the killhouse and went to the marshalls tower (using your appropriate team entrance/exit) and they could could the number of folk coming out from either team.

normally they'd run set number of lives per person instead of per team.

 

[Immortal]

I’ve never come across this system before (set number of team lives) what site uses it ? 

Only ever come across individual lives in game .

Some games at Dogtag will have a limted amount of lives. The rules can vary according to the game scenario. It can be a specific number for the whole team or can be limited to the individuals on the team (relying on pure honesty sometimes).

It may be as Mister G said that attackers are unlimited and defenders have 1, when the 1 life is up you fall back to the next section of the arena in play. Sometimes it's just say 50 respawns on both teams where once they're gone they're gone and the game draws to an end.

My comment is for the latter scenario. It doesn't apply to all Speedsofters and rushers alike. It's just many (IME) do get through more lives rushing in, getting hit, rushing back & repeat. Not saying they aren't taking scalps in the process but if the individual uses 10+ lives out of 70 and there's 70 on a team it's a little unfair as they are meant to be on a team. I've been walking to respawn and one fella has run back and forth 3 times lapping me. Perhaps I'm just slow and old (fashioned). lol :lol: (Granted some people will get hit more than others but that's natural IMHO).

Perhaps in hindsight my wording in my previous post is unfair singling out Speedsofters. I've seen normal skirmishers doing the same on occasions and I guess a percentage are Rushers. But the principle is the same (for me) regarding a fair use of respawns.

Like I said not all games are like that and when lives are unlimited it's no issue at all. It's no issue either way tbh as it's just a game but I do like a level of fairness not just in who you're fighting but also whom you are fighting with. Respect perhaps? It is a game afterall, it's gotta be fun for all.

I think I'm rambling and starting to deviate.... looooooool :lol:

 

[Rogerborg]

However when it gets to the point where firing rounds at me when Im dead (multiple rounds on multiple occasions) shooting me when the games not even started and just laughing it off and in game rage (Heard someone calming him down I think) due to dying is a different kettle of fish. I've never seen that sort of anger in Paintball, nor Airsoft before

That's out of order and needs to be brought to the attention of the marshals, calmly and constructively.  I imagine that they start all briefings with "Don't be a dick, just play the game; no overkill; cheat calling is as bad as cheating..." and all the usual platitudes.  Find out if they mean it.

 

[Immortal]

I think he means a limited number of re-spawns for the team as a whole.  Eg at one of the sites I play at regularly defenders may have 20 respawns, and attackers have unlimited to keep the game moving.  One defender might use 10 respawns, while another might get none if he gets killed after all the 20 have been used up.

Exactly.

 

[Druid799]

Ahh right nearest I’ve come to that is my regular site if we’re doing a multi base game then the attackers have unlimited lives untill the last 15mins and defenders keep falling back till last base and it’s dead and out 

 

[Tommikka]

There are so many ways on managing numbers of lives/respawns and how respawning occurs.

One slightly different method over another can majorly influence game play, tactics used by each side and the results

I do like to see how one method or another affects a venue and mission 

Bleeding out was a fairly new one to me when I began to watch airsoft and seeing it as quite standard, it was similar to one of the medic styles we put into some of our events:

We tagged all players with a laminated card, and gave designated medics a pack containing their arm band, spare cards and a hole punch.

The generals and medics on each side could then decide on how to operate their medics - up in a firefight or just back enough to be safe.  When players were hit they could decide on how they wanted to respawn:

1) the long walk for a ‘free’ spawn at a designated point or they could take a break in the safe zone.  No hole punches 

2) falling back to the medic for a nearer spawn getting their card punched, then getting a fresh card once full

3) staying put, possibly still in danger of being shot in crossfire.   Calling upon a combat medic to rush in to punch their card back to life, and perhaps needing a new card as well adding to the delay and risk to the medic

4) medics couldn’t be healed and had to fall back to respawn, and subsequent players had to fall back to respawn due to missing medic - or wait

1 was time consuming and lost players from crucial objectives

2 kept medics safe and a good flow of players

3 kept the ground that had been gained, and was pivotal quite a few times

4 was very likely and medics were targeted causing sudden losses when victory was almost in your hand 

There were a few bragging rights earned by those wearing a lot of punched cards, but the medics came out on top 

 

[Immortal]

There are so many ways on managing numbers of lives/respawns and how respawning occurs.

One slightly different method over another can majorly influence game play, tactics used by each side and the results

I do like to see how one method or another affects a venue and mission 

Bleeding out was a fairly new one to me when I began to watch airsoft and seeing it as quite standard, it was similar to one of the medic styles we put into some of our events:

We tagged all players with a laminated card, and gave designated medics a pack containing their arm band, spare cards and a hole punch.

The generals and medics on each side could then decide on how to operate their medics - up in a firefight or just back enough to be safe.  When players were hit they could decide on how they wanted to respawn:

1) the long walk for a ‘free’ spawn at a designated point or they could take a break in the safe zone.  No hole punches 

2) falling back to the medic for a nearer spawn getting their card punched, then getting a fresh card once full

3) staying put, possibly still in danger of being shot in crossfire.   Calling upon a combat medic to rush in to punch their card back to life, and perhaps needing a new card as well adding to the delay and risk to the medic

4) medics couldn’t be healed and had to fall back to respawn, and subsequent players had to fall back to respawn due to missing medic - or wait

1 was time consuming and lost players from crucial objectives

2 kept medics safe and a good flow of players

3 kept the ground that had been gained, and was pivotal quite a few times

4 was very likely and medics were targeted causing sudden losses when victory was almost in your hand 

There were a few bragging rights earned by those wearing a lot of punched cards, but the medics came out on top 

Interesting way of using medics (punchcards etc). Seems to be what the US games do a lot (or a variant of what you described).

I've only played one place (Battle Lakes) with the bleed out rule and it sorta worked, mostly not IMHO. One thing that seemed a little off was "dead men can't talk" which is normal but apparently nor can a wounded one?!

That seemed a little daft as that is one time to be very vocal.... "MEDIC!!!!"

I wonder; did the whole card punching and not leaving to respawn lead to arguements as it may appear like your not taking hits if you just bunker down, stay in the spot and carry on as if nothing has happened (once card is punched etc)?

I guess if the rule is clearly known then 'no'.

 

[Adolf Hamster]

the way i've seen the americans do it which is quite interesting is the buddy/medic system where first hit you just get tagged back in by anyone, but you get hit again you need a medic who makes you drink a bottle of water  then you're back in (interesting way of keeping folks hydrated).

of course if the medic gets downed or he runs out of water it's a long walk to respawn.

kind of like the idea as it means a medic only has a limited amount of respawning he can do while out in the field, so a trapped squad can eventually be wiped out once the medic is out of water bottles to dish out.

the universal problem i've noticed with medic games employed here is medics that don't understand the role, or sites dishing it out the wrong people, so you end up with support gunner medics rushing into objectives, getting killed, then leaving their comrades to fend for themselves.

 

[Immortal]

I kinda like the idea too. I often play with a bolt action from afar so using a downed player as bait could be fun.