We L85 Mag Issue

[JinxDuh]

So, bit of a weird one I’ve not ran into before…

The 3 WE M4 mags I have, all seem to be dropping down on my SA80 resulting in dry firing with no BB’s being pushed into battery. If you slowly push the bolt forwards watching the nozzle, you can see the nozzle actually push the BB down in the magazine. 
 

I assumed the mag catch was worn, but it seems fine except from one corner worn slightly. These same mags work flawlessly in my M16A1 so I don’t think it’s a magazine issue, plus it does it on all 3 mags. 
 

I thought about tape, but I tried 3 different spots with no luck. Anybody have any ideas for a fix?

 

[gavinkempsell]

Do you get the same results while holding the mag?

 

[Nick G]

If it does it with all the mags , and still does it with upward pressure on the mags, I'd be looking at the prong on the loading nozzle to see if its damaged.

 

[JinxDuh]

Do you get the same results while holding the mag?

No, holding the mag up feeds with absolutely 0 issues. However, it drops quite a bit afterwards! 

If it does it with all the mags , and still does it with upward pressure on the mags, I'd be looking at the prong on the loading nozzle to see if its damaged.

That was my initial thought, as my m16a1 came with that issue but nozzle is all good!

 

[gavinkempsell]

Then fiddle with the mag and see if rocking it back or forward helps or makes it worse, mags might just be loose in the mag well.

 

[JinxDuh]

Then fiddle with the mag and see if rocking it back or forward helps or makes it worse, mags might just be loose in the mag well.

That's why I tried the tape trick, normally does work but this time nothing. 

When I insert the mag (With the top half off) the bolt release bar turns at an angle (Roughly 45 degrees), I was wondering if that is normal?

 

[Nick G]

That's why I tried the tape trick, normally does work but this time nothing. 

When I insert the mag (With the top half off) the bolt release bar turns at an angle (Roughly 45 degrees), I was wondering if that is normal?

Just looked at mine, when i first put a loaded mag in the bolt release bar does rotate up, however when I let the mag drop into it's 'resting' position , IE sitting on the mag catch, the release bar returns to normal resting position.  

Obviously with an empty mag the bar remains raised even when mag sat on catch.

Are the mags working ok in the M16 ?

 

[JinxDuh]

Just looked at mine, when i first put a loaded mag in the bolt release bar does rotate up, however when I let the mag drop into it's 'resting' position , IE sitting on the mag catch, the release bar returns to normal resting position.  

Obviously with an empty mag the bar remains raised even when mag sat on catch.

Are the mags working ok in the M16 ?

I'll have to double check and see if mine does the same...

All 3 of the "30 rounders" work fine in my m16a1 with no issue, feeds every bb etc. I figured I'd try the "20 rounders" in my SA80 and had the same issue. When I was testing the SA80 earlier, rarely one BB will make it through however now I know it's having issues I don't want to fire it properly in case more damage is caused. 

 

[Nick G]

Unless the mag is sitting very low once in position which could be the catch, it still feels like a nozzle issue to me . 

 

[JinxDuh]

Unless the mag is sitting very low once in position which could be the catch, it still feels like a nozzle issue to me . 

I'll have to take a video or image of the issue tomorrow. I've never ran into this issue before!

It fires fine when the mag is held up, might have to invest in some elastic bands and stick it around the mag and rifle ?

 

[Nick G]

Couple of pics of mine with a loaded mag in, that's in the resting position sat on the mag catch.View attachment 127788View attachment 127787

 

[JinxDuh]

Just thinking back, when I got the rifle stripped down the first time for the normal degrease/regrease there was a lot of BB fragments around the BCG from what I assume was from when I tested it the moment I got it. It hasn’t happened since, so I think tomorrow I’ll disassemble the BCG and check it all. Possibly replace the return spring too as it’s a bit sticky

 

[JinxDuh]

Nozzle seems fine, will change the spring still as it sticks but can’t see any faults with the “arm”

With the magazine in, the bolt catch twists at an angle both empty and loaded. 

View attachment 127797

View attachment 127798

View attachment 127799

View attachment 127800

View attachment 127801

View attachment 127802

The top of the blue tape is where the bottom of the mag well is lined up when the magazine is at the “correct” position, so there’s quite a drop. It’s roughly 0.5cm of difference. The video shows the movement better. 

View attachment 127803



IMG_5230.mov
This is the “optimal” position for the tape, which locks the mag into the correct spot and lets it fire. A fix, but not ideal…

Any ideas greatly appreciated ?

View attachment 127805

 

[gavinkempsell]

Is the mag catch straight? looks buckled in the pic. do you have another L85 you could swop this with to see if it helps?

 

[JinxDuh]

Is the mag catch straight? looks buckled in the pic. do you have another L85 you could swop this with to see if it helps?

Mag catch seems okay in person, sadly I don’t have another to test. I did notice a scuff mark on the BB’s, like a small black line which is the same size as the nozzle arm so I’m assuming that’s a part of the problem. 
 

So far, I’ve taped all 3 mags and they all work and feed fine (And still fit/feed in my M16A1 ?), so I’m going to run it as is for the time being until either the mag catch fails or the nozzle and then replace both!

 

[Nick G]

That's a significamt difference in height. The pictures with the mag in from above, is that with the mag 'lifted' or sat on the catch ?

Nozzle prong certainly looks the same as mine. 

If you have the mag in the low position (sat on the catch) does the gun fire ok if an empty mag is set to dry fire ? If the valve knocker ries over the output valve rather than hits it that might point to a mag location issue which would suggest the mag catch.

 

[gavinkempsell]

I'm convinced the mag catch is to blame, does it wobble?

 

[JinxDuh]

The pictures with the mag in from above, is that with the mag 'lifted' or sat on the catch ?

It's with the mag lifted, yes.

does the gun fire ok if an empty mag is set to dry fire

Yeah, it'll dry fire like it's cycling. I did also note that on empty it wouldn't lock back (It does on my m16), not sure if the L85 is designed to do so?

does it wobble?

Before the tape, yeah it had some play in every direction. Now it's solid ?

 

[Nick G]

Yes the L85 should lock back on empty. Benning to look like the mag catch 

Top of the tape is where my magwell comes to , looks about the same as your 'lifted' mark. If the top tape is with thye mag sat on the catch I'd say your mag catch is buggered.

View attachment 127828

 

[JinxDuh]

Yes the L85 should lock back on empty. Benning to look like the mag catch 

Top of the tape is where my magwell comes to , looks about the same as your 'lifted' mark. If the top tape is with thye mag sat on the catch I'd say your mag catch is buggered.

View attachment 127828

Awesome. Well, not really… but at least I have a lead! ?

Thank you so much guys for the help!!!