JamesAirsofterAgent
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Not posted as an insult to any cadet force, just for questions etc as I have a few....no surprise there!
Cadet thread.
- Thread starter JamesAirsofterAgent
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TacMaster
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While some people leave the ACF because "It's boring and we don't do much" those people are the ones who don't commit, don't pass the subject tests and don't get to the next star level. In a nutshell, the amount of stuff you do depends on tests passed
For example:
On a personnel note- the ATC training staff I have met have been absolute twats. Including one incident a few years ago-
I had arrived at the detachment on a Wednesday night for our weekly parade. We share the detachment with the ATC, however they parade on Tuesday and Thursday nights.
There were 3 unfamiliar people outside the detachment- 2 in RAF blues and one in civvies. I assumed the 2nd one in blues (a cadet) had come back from a camp as he had a bergen. I could see no visible rank on either adult. As said before, one was in civvies.
I was walking past to the door and the male adult cleared his throat as if to gain my attention. I turned towards him and he had a go at me about not saluting officers when this kong is clearly not wearing a rank or uniform, and the other instructor was wearing a rank nobody outside the ATC and RAF should be expected to recognise.
TL;DR- ATC staff can be a bunch of knobbers. As well as various other things like putting padlocks on the fridge door and one of the remaining cupboards in the detachment's kitchen.
For example:
- If you are a Basic Training cadet, you cannot go on Annual camps until you are a 1 star
- You cannot handle or fire any weapon until you have done a Weapons Handling Test- the only exception is if you are handling the weapon while doing the test. WHTs have to be completed every 6 months, and it's the same in all the forces.
- You cannot go on exchange trips to other countries (we did one last year to Canada, we've also done them to Kentucky, USA, and to Lithuania) if you are a Basic.
On a personnel note- the ATC training staff I have met have been absolute twats. Including one incident a few years ago-
I had arrived at the detachment on a Wednesday night for our weekly parade. We share the detachment with the ATC, however they parade on Tuesday and Thursday nights.
There were 3 unfamiliar people outside the detachment- 2 in RAF blues and one in civvies. I assumed the 2nd one in blues (a cadet) had come back from a camp as he had a bergen. I could see no visible rank on either adult. As said before, one was in civvies.
I was walking past to the door and the male adult cleared his throat as if to gain my attention. I turned towards him and he had a go at me about not saluting officers when this kong is clearly not wearing a rank or uniform, and the other instructor was wearing a rank nobody outside the ATC and RAF should be expected to recognise.
TL;DR- ATC staff can be a bunch of knobbers. As well as various other things like putting padlocks on the fridge door and one of the remaining cupboards in the detachment's kitchen.
Chock
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You should have pointed out to him that you don't salute the person, you salute the rank, and you don't generally salute someone when they are in civvies, since they are not wearing a rank, and as noted, you salute the rank.
Best story I ever heard on that subject, was regarding the legendary (and hugely decorated) US Marine, Lt. Gen. Lewis Burwell 'Chesty' Puller: Puller came across a pedantic Second Lt who had ordered an enlisted man to salute him 100 times for having missed a salute, whereupon Puller told the Lieutenant: 'You were absolutely correct in making him salute you 100 times Lieutenant. But, you know that an officer must return every salute he receives. Now return them all, and I will keep count.'
Incidentally, back on the thread topic, I was in the ATC, it was okay, but there are definitely more opportunities to do stuff in the Army Cadets. I do fly gliders and do have a pilot's licence, but i never did that in the ATC.
Actually you should salute an officer if they are wearing civvies IF you recognise them.
Chock
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True, but in the example TacMaster was quoting, he did mention that the people in question were 'unfamiliar'.
n1ckh
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I was in the army cadets and my boys are now
Its changed so much over the 20 odd years I did it, there detachment is under the 'rifles' badge and wear the modern MTP kit but also being in the band, they also wear the no1 uniform which is a mix of the light infantry and the green jackets. I had to sew on 9 buttons to replace the old ones on my eldests tunic
Now they start with a basic badge which is a plain blue star then once tested and pass, they will get there 1 star badge (blue star with no 1 in it)
Due to accidents, adventure sports is limited, no more 'military' vehicle/aircraft jollys, no off-road driving and all transport are cars, coaches and white mini buses only
IMO, the ATC is academic focused, the SCC (sea cadet corps) all pomp and bullshit
Where as the ACF & RMC (royal marine cadets) is all hands on training out in the mud and rain
I was always told 'never' salute anyone in civvies and not wearing a visible rank
Its changed so much over the 20 odd years I did it, there detachment is under the 'rifles' badge and wear the modern MTP kit but also being in the band, they also wear the no1 uniform which is a mix of the light infantry and the green jackets. I had to sew on 9 buttons to replace the old ones on my eldests tunic
Now they start with a basic badge which is a plain blue star then once tested and pass, they will get there 1 star badge (blue star with no 1 in it)
Due to accidents, adventure sports is limited, no more 'military' vehicle/aircraft jollys, no off-road driving and all transport are cars, coaches and white mini buses only
IMO, the ATC is academic focused, the SCC (sea cadet corps) all pomp and bullshit
Where as the ACF & RMC (royal marine cadets) is all hands on training out in the mud and rain
I was always told 'never' salute anyone in civvies and not wearing a visible rank
jcheeseright
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TacMaster
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We still have a little fun in the real vehicles, albeit rarely. My company had the fortune to secure an RAF Merlin for use during an excersize on annual camp this year. Legendary fun, got a drop off and extraction after securing a 'Tornado pilot' who was 'captured' by local 'militia' in the scenario we were given.The training video for the Merlin we were shown was so early 2000s it made me cringe.
As for adventurous training- we still do fairly risky activities. Last year we had some fun kayaking in a reservoir near Dartmoor, and we did some proper rock climbing on a cliff face too. All carefully controlled activities with helmets and umpteen First Aid kits, safety staff and minibuses ready for a trip to A&E
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BBrotherwood
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That's not always the case. My Wing had a lot of ex army staff so we had a lot of field craft camps and shooting days as a wing. On the flip side due to the OC of our Region being a complete dick, we were not allowed to do any of the field craft with rifles full stop, unlike the other 5 regions in the ATC who could.
As i've said before what an individual unit does really depends on the staff they have available. The closest sqn to ours before it shut down literally did nothing but field craft as all 3 of there staff had/were serving in the forces as well. On the other hand speaking to other cadets from other sqns all they did on a parade night was drill/band and theory stuff as there staff lacked qualifications/experience. The biggest problem with all the cadet forces is that there is little consistency between units. Having spoken to other units I would say my former sqn had the right balance to the different activity's, but other units definitely did not but you cant find that out until you join and spend a few months there.
TacMaster
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That also tends to be the case in the ACF. My Company's quite good for it, however we have a Platoon in Bordon who only do fieldcraft and drill- my Platoon shares the same parent regiment as them (REME) so I've had to teach some of their cadets the history of the regiment right before the test. The facilities also impact training. We have a Platoon right outside Aldershot in a TA training centre who keep about half the Company's rifles in the armouries there, so they can easily do hands-on Skill at Arms lessons. In contrast, we only have a secure safe which usually has some Drill Purpose L98A2s (deactivated A2s) and sometimes we'll have 2 or 3 No. 8 .22 rifles there. This means we can't do a great deal of SAA.
Having been one of the so called "twats", sorry, commissioned officer in the RAFVR(T), I can assure you that this is NOT bullshit and that an officer SHOULD be saluted IF they are recognised.
n1ckh
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I'm talking from my own personal experience in the ACF and what my boys OC has told what they do now
We did something similar to a kid who didn't shower so on the last night, we threw him in the shower and scrubbed him with brushes
Before lights out, we'd stick hard objects in a pillow case and then have a pillow fight, gambling was another we did by seeing who got coins closest to the skirting board, the old but good boot polish on peoples faces and pinning them down under there ponchos
We did something similar to a kid who didn't shower so on the last night, we threw him in the shower and scrubbed him with brushes
Before lights out, we'd stick hard objects in a pillow case and then have a pillow fight, gambling was another we did by seeing who got coins closest to the skirting board, the old but good boot polish on peoples faces and pinning them down under there ponchos
BBrotherwood
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Most surreal thing I had happen to me was waking up in the middle of the night and not being able to move. I was too shattered to care and went back to sleep. Woke up the next morning to find out they had completely wrapped me up from head to foot in toilet role.
Zak Da Mack
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- Nov 30, 2012
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Well, we all need to rely on someone when they play the national anthem at parades with their triangles and trombones
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My most memorable moment on a camp was when I was doing my ranger course (do they still do that?). About 3 in the morning I was on sentry and heard some rustling. I thought "Bollocks, going to have to wake everyone up". I could not see anything at all, but the rustling was still going on. I quietly cooked my rifle and waited. Then out on the path in the moonlight I saw a badger making it's way with someone's ration box. The next morning a lost soul was demanding his rations back whilst other where wondering why they had a black line on their neck. Turns out some Ghurkers where on the same camp and snuck into our camp and "killed" people. Everyone who did sentry that night had to do a 5km run before we was allowed to get grub for breakfast.
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